[games_access] XBox One reception on twitter (Steve Spohn)

Fri May 24 13:24:15 EDT 2013

Actually, android can pretty much support any USB input peripheral as well,
assuming it uses the standard HID protocol. All you need is a "USB OTG"
cable. Obviously Bluetooth is way more practical for true mobile
applications, but in cases where you absolutely need to use something like
a tiny trackball or touchpad that aren't available with Bluetooth, it's a
great fallback option to have.

-John

**

*-- -- -- -- --
John R. Porter III
www.jrp3.net
University of Washington,**
Human Centered Design & Engineering*

On Thu, May 23, 2013 at 2:04 AM, Lynsey Graham <
lgraham at blitzgamesstudios.com> wrote:

> Android is interesting, because you can use Bluetooth peripherals with it–
> I can’t remember exactly what my husband was playing, but I remember him
> using a PS3 controller to play an Android game.  I know when we at Blitz
> were musing about making a mobile platform adventure game, it was
> specifically mentioned having multiple control systems (touchscreen only,
> onscreen virtual controls & external controller compatible controls).  We
> might see more games being compatible with external controllers if Ouya
> takes off, as it also uses  Android – there might be more developers
> looking to release the same titles on both the Ouya and mobile/tablet
> Android devices.****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* games_access-bounces at igda.org [mailto:
> games_access-bounces at igda.org] *On Behalf Of *Barrie Ellis
> *Sent:* 23 May 2013 08:28
>
> *To:* IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List
> *Subject:* Re: [games_access] XBox One reception on twitter (Steve Spohn)*
> ***
>
> ** **
>
> The state of game accessibility worries me a bit at the minute. Especially
> so re. physical access.****
>
>  ****
>
> I like very much what Komodo Open Lab and others have done to make
> Apple iOS games more accessible... But the fact remains the vast majority
> of games are impossible to play unless you can touch the screen. And I've
> never seen a worse platform for games that should be possible to make
> one-switch accessible, and yet remain out of reach.****
>
>  ****
>
> I won't lie, I don't fully understand the Android platform for it's
> potential accessibility - but it does leave me feeling confused. I wonder
> how non-experienced Game Accessibility people find it when trying to find
> access solutions. ****
>
>  ****
>
> Sony seem obsessed with making the most complex, jam-packed controller
> possible. It's sad to me that some of my favourite games on the PS3 remain
> extremely hard/impossible for me to make accessible for quite a broad
> portion of the physical disabilities spectrum (Flower and Heavy Rain) due
> to Six-Axis being forced on the player with no alternative. The new
> controller looks like a potential nightmare for excluding people who can't
> cope with the huge array of possibilities - because I'm 99.9% sure that
> Sony won't give any advice on offering more accessible options for
> controls. Look at the new shiny thing!****
>
>  ****
>
> ****
>
>  ****
>
> Nintendo were utterly short-sighted with the Wii, forcing people to use a
> controller that requires a high-degree of physical accuracy to just
> navigate the menu screens - and not asking people to consider those who
> might not be able to use the Wii-remote. The Wii-U? Seems like an absurd
> degree of accuracy is needed for that and I see no fixes for it that aren't
> going to cost a huge amount.****
>
>  ****
>
> Microsoft's blocks on 3rd party controllers was highly disabling frankly
> for the Xbox 360. What a mean minded decision that was, to try to stop
> people using alternative controls. I think Microsoft redeemed themselves by
> not trying to take down the adapters that help get around this issue, and
> ended up allowing a massive range of alternative controls. The Kinect
> promised so much, so I do remain hopeful for Kinect 2. But as Ian
> indicated, without some guidance coming from Microsoft to developers I can
> foresee Xbox One living moving into iOS/Wii territory of there only being a
> handful of games that think about those who will prefer/need to use an
> alternative control method - but the majority not giving it a thought. I
> hope I'm wrong.****
>
>  ****
>
> Maybe a carefully worded open letter (more so than above!) might be
> something we could present to all platform developers with their ever more
> demanding proprietary control methods. ****
>
>  ****
>
> Game accessibility was better in so many ways back in 1982 which seems so
> wrong to me.****
>
>  ****
>
> Barrie****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* Ian Hamilton <i_h at hotmail.com> ****
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 22, 2013 4:53 PM****
>
> *To:* games_access at igda.org ****
>
> *Subject:* Re: [games_access]XBox One reception on twitter (Steve Spohn)**
> **
>
> ** **
>
>
> Nice article, esp. the TV mention.
>
> That's the real shame about Kinect, that it's give with one hand take away
> with the other, when it would be so easy for them to avoid it being bad for
> anyone, and be left with only the benefits - if only there was enough will
> from the decision makers.
>
> But still, maybe their advice to developers will be different this time
> around. Can live in hope I suppose.
>
> ----- Reply message -----
> From: games_access-request at igda.org
> To: <games_access at igda.org>
> Subject: games_access Digest, Vol 113, Issue 14
> Date: Wed, May 22, 2013 5:28 PM
>
>
>
>
> Send games_access mailing list submissions to
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>
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> than "Re: Contents of games_access digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: XBox One reception on twitter (Steve Spohn)
>    2. Re: games_access Digest, Vol 113, Issue 13 (Ian Hamilton)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 22 May 2013 11:11:41 -0400
> From: Steve Spohn <steve at ablegamers.com>
> Subject: Re: [games_access] XBox One reception on twitter
> To: IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List <games_access at igda.org>
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CABrM+MXEyWM-KpdODVxwTCmWHOV1-cc86foQvJAoFxLb9bXoPw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Here's AbleGamers take on it. Accessibility thoughts on Xbox One by
> AbleGamers' Rob McCaulley -- You let us down Microsoft --
>
> http://www.ablegamers.com/Disabled-Gamers-General-News/thoughts-on-xbox-one.html
>
> Also, from the conversations AbleGamers has had with Microsoft, they are
> aware of the need for greater accessibility with Xbox One. Kinect always
> being on was their way of trying to add it. It could work or it could
> backfire. Don't forget, Kinect locked many people like myself out, but
> added some people like our friend Giddeon from an abilities Expo to the
> gamer community.
>
>
> On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 11:08 AM, John R. Porter <jrporter at uw.edu> wrote:
>
> > As I see a lot of these tweets and articles passing through, a great many
> > of them come off as somewhat preemptively alarmist to me. People are, in
> > many cases, talking about the new Kinect as a controller-killer, but
> that's
> > improbable to the degree of being completely moot. By its nature, its
> never
> > going to be as efficient as a traditional controller for a lot of games,
> so
> > developers will never be crazy enough to force its exclusive use.
> >
> > Ultimately, the most likely long-term effect of forcing the Kinect
> > hardware to be ubiquitous is that games will start to embrace it more
> > frequently for *supplemental* interaction. It will be used in addition
> to,
> > not in replacement of, traditional controllers. Admittedly, this is still
> > potentially cause for concern among disabled gamers, but it will largely
> > depend on how these supplemental interactions manifest.
> >
> > I don't see games requiring you to suddenly put down the controller and
> > start flailing around in the middle of a game very often, because that's
> > totally an immersion-breaking and inefficient bit of design. More likely,
> > we'll see more and more games using things like Mass Effect's squad voice
> > commands, and potentially (depending on hardware capabilities) things
> like
> > gaze tracking for menu navigation and targeting. The Kinect is so much
> more
> > than a tool that lets you play Dance Central, even though that paradigm
> > might have dominated the first generation of motion control. That
> certainly
> > doesn't mean it's all the technology has to offer, though.
> >
> > Just my two cents...
> > -John
> >
> > **
> >
> > *-- -- -- -- --
> > John R. Porter III
> > www.jrp3.net
> > University of Washington,**
> > Human Centered Design & Engineering*
> >
> >
> > On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 6:42 AM, Ian Hamilton <i_h at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> *
> >> *
> >> There has been a fair bit of twitter chatter from disabled gamers
> >> following the launch announcement, mostly around the fact that it is not
> >> possible to buy an XBox without a Kinect, and that it will not turn on
> >> without a Kinect attached.
> >>
> >>
> >> Most of the concerns are due to the  the assumption that you won't be
> >> able to use the console without gestures and speech. Personally I'd be
> >> surprised if the main console interface requires gestures/speech, but
> >> Microsoft's statement on the issue shows a pretty dangerous side to it:
> >>
> >>
> >> *"By having it as a consistent part of every Xbox One, game and
> >> entertainment creators can build experiences that assume the
> availability
> >> of voice, gesture and natural sensing, leading to unrivaled ease of use,
> >> premium experiences and interactivity for you."*
> >> *
> >> *
> >> *
> >> *
> >> This is where the real problem lies. Currently Kinect accessibility at
> OS
> >> level and in non-exclusive games too is pretty good, with simpler
> >> alternative input methods often available. MS clearly wants developers
> to
> >> feel assured that all of their players are kinect-capable so that they
> feel
> >> comfortable with greater reliance on Kinect-exclusive input.
> >>
> >>
> >> All of their players being kinect-capable is obviously not the case, and
> >> although it's far too early to know for certain I'm concerned that we'll
> >> see more and more kinect-exclusive controls, expecting people to be
> able to
> >> move their bodies, talk, and operate complex controls simultaneously.
> >> *
> >> *
> >> *
> >> *
> >> Microsoft could avoid this extremely easily by simple including some
> >> accessibility requirements in the XBox One TCRs, but as that would
> directly
> >> clash with the business objective of pushing the new platform.. well,
> we'll
> >> see soon enough.
> >> *
> >> *
> >> *
> >> *
> >> *Changes to controller design*
> >>
> >>
> >> @KnarkyBadger
> >> @IGNUK hmm as a disabled gamer I think its looks a bit suspect to me
> dont
> >> think I'll be able to use it :(
> >>
> >>
> >> *Kinect required at all times*
> >>
> >>
> >> @spritesbites
> >> Dear Microsoft will Xbox One have a kinect REQUIREMENT? What about
> >> disabled gamers who struggle with body movements?
> >>
> >>
> >> @CaniLupine
> >> Another thing Microsoft overlooked: Disabled gamers. How are they going
> >> to use the Kinect if they are physically unable to do what it asks?
> >>
> >>
> >> @pandatr0nics
> >> Gamers with various disabilities may have problems with Xbox One being
> >> Kinect required we'll just have to wait and see
> >>
> >>
> >> @bagmanman
> >> Xbox One requiring Kinect to actually use the device is a HUGE way to
> >> alienate the disabled gamer community.
> >>
> >>
> >> @nebulaegirl
> >> Ok, new XBOX looks great, but what about game accessibility for disabled
> >> gamers? # xboxreveal  # AbleGamers
> >>
> >>
> >> @GamingJay85
> >> Wow, back in 2010, I wrote about how Kinect was flipping off disabled
> >> gamers and how it'd be a party game implement.
> >> http://www.pinkanddeadly.com/?p=283
> >>
> >>
> >> @shogan01
> >> but yet again with these consoles #xboxone discriminates the disabled
> >> gamer
> >>
> >>
> >> @justineckblad
> >> @N0M4DTV As a fellow disabled gamer, whats your take on Xbox1 requiring
> >> the kinect? Not sure it works with me in my WC & my bad voice. :/
> >>
> >>
> >> @TheNewBoyWonder
> >> @Xbox How does requiring Kinect effect disabled gamer? What if I can't
> >> stand on my feet during a 2 hr CoD session?
> >>
> >>
> >> @Zzephferus
> >> @MicrosoftXbox Why is the connected needed for the Xbox One to work?
> What
> >> about disabled gamers or gamers with speech problems?
> >>
> >>
> >> @skipsophrenic
> >> @NaomiKyle #xboxone as a disabled gamer who relies on the controller
> >> reports on it needing the kinect has me concerned need to test b4 buy.
> >>
> >>
> >> *Paying fees for used games*
> >>
> >>
> >> @VirtuousLumox
> >> @EmInterrupted As a disabled gamer with no income who uses games to pass
> >> the time so I don't rot my brain watching TV, I'm very concerned.
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> games_access mailing list
> >> games_access at igda.org
> >> http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
> >> The main SIG website page is http://igda-gasig.org
> >>
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > games_access mailing list
> > games_access at igda.org
> > http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
> > The main SIG website page is http://igda-gasig.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Steve Spohn
> Editor-In-Chief
> The AbleGamers Foundation
> AbleGamers.com <http://www.ablegamers.com/> |
> AbleGamers.org<http://www.ablegamers.org/>
>  | Facebook <http://www.facebook.com/ablegamers> |
> Twitter<http://www.twitter.com/ablegamers>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 22 May 2013 16:28:14 +0100
> From: Ian Hamilton <i_h at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [games_access] games_access Digest, Vol 113, Issue 13
> To: "games_access at igda.org" <games_access at igda.org>
> Message-ID: <DUB116-W96C980EBA213247EC2FE0991A90 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Yep likewise, I'd be astounded if you were required to use speech or
> gestures in the way that many are assuming, it sounds more like a hardware
> requirement than a software requirement to me, that the requirement is just
> for it to be present and plugged in, nothing more. Clearly they're seeing
> lack of adoption as a barrier to developers using it, so they're trying to
> guarantee greater adoption.
>
> I totally agree about that being the approach to take too, using it just
> for optional enhancements, that are either trivial enough that lack of
> access doesn't matter, or that are also accessible using other input
> methods.
>
> I haven't done any Kinect development but have worked on a fair few
> regular webcam games, and the same principle applies.. there are very very
> few games that genuinely require motion detection, they're almost always
> perfectly suited to regular controls too. The usual line I've been given is
> "that would ruin the whole fun of the game".. if what you're seeing as 'the
> whole fun of the game' is the fact that it uses a novel input device, then
> you're already in trouble!
>
> I just hope firstly that MS firstly thinks that way too, and secondly gets
> that message across to developers, as there are certainly plenty of
> developers crazy enough to do Kinect-exclusives still, even when you've got
> things like Child of Eden that show how totally unnecessary
> Kinect-exclusive controls are.
>
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Wed, 22 May 2013 08:08:34 -0700
> > From: "John R. Porter" <jrporter at uw.edu>
> > Subject: Re: [games_access] XBox One reception on twitter
> > To: IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List <games_access at igda.org>
> > Message-ID:
> >       <
> CADWyad-Dfry7bTQ90AOer0ShfZQCHBVXwG9nhFPUTjiU=gxxxg at mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >
> > As I see a lot of these tweets and articles passing through, a great many
> > of them come off as somewhat preemptively alarmist to me. People are, in
> > many cases, talking about the new Kinect as a controller-killer, but
> that's
> > improbable to the degree of being completely moot. By its nature, its
> never
> > going to be as efficient as a traditional controller for a lot of games,
> so
> > developers will never be crazy enough to force its exclusive use.
> >
> > Ultimately, the most likely long-term effect of forcing the Kinect
> hardware
> > to be ubiquitous is that games will start to embrace it more frequently
> for
> > *supplemental* interaction. It will be used in addition to, not in
> > replacement of, traditional controllers. Admittedly, this is still
> > potentially cause for concern among disabled gamers, but it will largely
> > depend on how these supplemental interactions manifest.
> >
> > I don't see games requiring you to suddenly put down the controller and
> > start flailing around in the middle of a game very often, because that's
> > totally an immersion-breaking and inefficient bit of design. More likely,
> > we'll see more and more games using things like Mass Effect's squad voice
> > commands, and potentially (depending on hardware capabilities) things
> like
> > gaze tracking for menu navigation and targeting. The Kinect is so much
> more
> > than a tool that lets you play Dance Central, even though that paradigm
> > might have dominated the first generation of motion control. That
> certainly
> > doesn't mean it's all the technology has to offer, though.
> >
> > Just my two cents...
> > -John
> >
> > **
> >
> > *-- -- -- -- --
> > John R. Porter III
> > www.jrp3.net
> > University of Washington,**
> > Human Centered Design & Engineering*
> >
> >
> > On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 6:42 AM, Ian Hamilton <i_h at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > *
> > > *
> > > There has been a fair bit of twitter chatter from disabled gamers
> > > following the launch announcement, mostly around the fact that it is
> not
> > > possible to buy an XBox without a Kinect, and that it will not turn on
> > > without a Kinect attached.
> > >
> > >
> > > Most of the concerns are due to the  the assumption that you won't be
> able
> > > to use the console without gestures and speech. Personally I'd be
> surprised
> > > if the main console interface requires gestures/speech, but Microsoft's
> > > statement on the issue shows a pretty dangerous side to it:
> > >
> > >
> > > *"By having it as a consistent part of every Xbox One, game and
> > > entertainment creators can build experiences that assume the
> availability
> > > of voice, gesture and natural sensing, leading to unrivaled ease of
> use,
> > > premium experiences and interactivity for you."*
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *
> > > This is where the real problem lies. Currently Kinect accessibility at
> OS
> > > level and in non-exclusive games too is pretty good, with simpler
> > > alternative input methods often available. MS clearly wants developers
> to
> > > feel assured that all of their players are kinect-capable so that they
> feel
> > > comfortable with greater reliance on Kinect-exclusive input.
> > >
> > >
> > > All of their players being kinect-capable is obviously not the case,
> and
> > > although it's far too early to know for certain I'm concerned that
> we'll
> > > see more and more kinect-exclusive controls, expecting people to be
> able to
> > > move their bodies, talk, and operate complex controls simultaneously.
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *
> > > Microsoft could avoid this extremely easily by simple including some
> > > accessibility requirements in the XBox One TCRs, but as that would
> directly
> > > clash with the business objective of pushing the new platform.. well,
> we'll
> > > see soon enough.
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *Changes to controller design*
> > >
> > >
> > > @KnarkyBadger
> > > @IGNUK hmm as a disabled gamer I think its looks a bit suspect to me
> dont
> > > think I'll be able to use it :(
> > >
> > >
> > > *Kinect required at all times*
> > >
> > >
> > > @spritesbites
> > > Dear Microsoft will Xbox One have a kinect REQUIREMENT? What about
> > > disabled gamers who struggle with body movements?
> > >
> > >
> > > @CaniLupine
> > > Another thing Microsoft overlooked: Disabled gamers. How are they
> going to
> > > use the Kinect if they are physically unable to do what it asks?
> > >
> > >
> > > @pandatr0nics
> > > Gamers with various disabilities may have problems with Xbox One being
> > > Kinect required we'll just have to wait and see
> > >
> > >
> > > @bagmanman
> > > Xbox One requiring Kinect to actually use the device is a HUGE way to
> > > alienate the disabled gamer community.
> > >
> > >
> > > @nebulaegirl
> > > Ok, new XBOX looks great, but what about game accessibility for
> disabled
> > > gamers? # xboxreveal  # AbleGamers
> > >
> > >
> > > @GamingJay85
> > > Wow, back in 2010, I wrote about how Kinect was flipping off disabled
> > > gamers and how it'd be a party game implement.
> > > http://www.pinkanddeadly.com/?p=283
> > >
> > >
> > > @shogan01
> > > but yet again with these consoles #xboxone discriminates the disabled
> gamer
> > >
> > >
> > > @justineckblad
> > > @N0M4DTV As a fellow disabled gamer, whats your take on Xbox1 requiring
> > > the kinect? Not sure it works with me in my WC & my bad voice. :/
> > >
> > >
> > > @TheNewBoyWonder
> > > @Xbox How does requiring Kinect effect disabled gamer? What if I can't
> > > stand on my feet during a 2 hr CoD session?
> > >
> > >
> > > @Zzephferus
> > > @MicrosoftXbox Why is the connected needed for the Xbox One to work?
> What
> > > about disabled gamers or gamers with speech problems?
> > >
> > >
> > > @skipsophrenic
> > > @NaomiKyle #xboxone as a disabled gamer who relies on the controller
> > > reports on it needing the kinect has me concerned need to test b4 buy.
> > >
> > >
> > > *Paying fees for used games*
> > >
> > >
> > > @VirtuousLumox
> > > @EmInterrupted As a disabled gamer with no income who uses games to
> pass
> > > the time so I don't rot my brain watching TV, I'm very concerned.
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > games_access mailing list
> > > games_access at igda.org
> > > http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
> > > The main SIG website page is http://igda-gasig.org
> > >
> > >
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> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > games_access mailing list
> > games_access at igda.org
> > http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
> > The main SIG website page is http://igda-gasig.org
> >
> > End of games_access Digest, Vol 113, Issue 13
> > *********************************************
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> _______________________________________________
> games_access mailing list
> games_access at igda.org
> http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
> The main SIG website page is http://igda-gasig.org
>
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> *************************************************
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> games_access mailing list
> games_access at igda.org
> http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
> The main SIG website page is http://igda-gasig.org****
>
>
>
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