[game_edu] Internship question

Tue Jan 27 17:15:35 EST 2015

If it's a start-up made by recent grads, then they probably aren't qualified to be offering internships. The whole point of seeking an internship is so the student can get training and mentorship from an expert in the field. I've seen internships like this before offered by local start-ups and most of the companies didn't really train the students - they just used them as free labor.

Even if there wasn't a non-compete, I'd advise students against interning for this company because they probably won't learn the lessons they're seeking to learn. What they will learn is to be selective which companies they work for and how to recognize a bad deal, and these can be painful lessons to learn the hard way. In general, it's probably a bad idea to intern at a company with zero shipped titles.

Adam Moore
The University of Advancing Technology
Quality Assurance Technician
(650) 383-8660

From: game_edu [mailto:game_edu-bounces at igda.org] On Behalf Of Ben Chang
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2015 3:03 PM
To: game_edu at igda.org
Subject: Re: [game_edu] Internship question

Thanks!  That was my thought as well, but I wanted to make sure I wasn't giving poor advice.

TBF the non-compete wasn't for all game development work; it applied to games with a similar topic and target audience, though to my mind that doesn't make it any better.  The company is a new startup that looks like it's also primarily people just out of school.  All of which tells me this is something I need to start covering in class.

--Ben

On 1/27/15 4:34 PM, Ian Schreiber via game_edu wrote:
Unpaid internships, regardless of anything else, are illegal in many states and are sketchy to begin with. Minimum wage is cheap, and a handful of paid interns isn't going to be the thing that makes or breaks a company's bottom line. They also have the down side of perpetuating a social class gap: students from disadvantaged backgrounds are less able to take an unpaid internship to begin with. I would tend to steer students away from unpaid internships in general (at least the good students; let the terrible students work for the company for free, as punishment to both the student and the company ;-). As for "you'll get great experience" - you know what else gives great experience without pay? Working on your own game. Have the interested students do that instead. As for "we might hire you if you do great work as an unpaid intern," if they underpay interns, I'd assume they don't treat you any better as a permanent employee, so that's not exactly a selling point either.

Non-competes are another red flag, ESPECIALLY at the intern level. To the extent that non-competes are okay, it's mainly to prevent someone like a team lead or director level employee from leaving the company and pulling half the dev team with them to start their own studio. (One could argue that a better defense against this situation is to treat your employees well enough that they wouldn't want to leave, rather than just sticking a legal poison bomb in their work contract, but whatever.) Telling a student that they can't work in the industry, though? I can't see any rational justification for this. Also, worth noting that non-competes are unenforceable in many jurisdictions.

Both of those things together? Not normal, definitely unethical, possibly illegal. I would stay far, far away. Definitely NOT the kind of place I would want my students to go.

If a student had other reasons that outweighed the negatives that made them really interested in this particular internship for some reason, I would have them research the labor laws in the state that the company lives in to see what their rights are.

- Ian

________________________________
From: Ben Chang <changb3 at rpi.edu><mailto:changb3 at rpi.edu>
To: game_edu at igda.org<mailto:game_edu at igda.org>
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2015 4:05 PM
Subject: [game_edu] Internship question

Hi all,

I have a student who's been offered an unpaid internship.  The contract
has as non-compete that would bar him from doing game dev work in a
related field for one year after completion.  Is this normal for unpaid
internship?  It seems disadvantageous.  The only value he receives from
performing the work is experience to use towards future employment, but
he would be prevented from seeking employment doing the thing he'd
gotten experience doing.

thanks,

--Ben Chang

--
Benjamin Chang
Associate Professor, Department of the Arts
Director, Games and Simulation Arts and Sciences
Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute
110 8th Street, Troy, NY 12180
changb3 at rpi.edu<mailto:changb3 at rpi.edu>
518.276.2366

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Benjamin Chang

Associate Professor, Department of the Arts

Director, Games and Simulation Arts and Sciences

Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute

110 8th Street, Troy, NY 12180

changb3 at rpi.edu<mailto:changb3 at rpi.edu>

518.276.2366
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