[SBE] The SBE Roundtable

[Barry Mishkind]

At 10:03 PM 5/4/2008, chscherer at everestkc.net, wrote


>And if you notice, what I have been striving for is looser than the 

>rules. Discussions about the Society is the official purpose, but 

>tech support and relevent broadcast engineering discussion are encouraged.


         I have purposely kept away from this subject
         as I have been well known over the years
         for noting the fragmentation of the mailing lists
         over the years. At one time there were just three
         or four: a Compuserve "forum," a Usenet News Group
         (filled with listeners and wannabees), and
         the BROADCAST list on FidoNet (with an SBE list
         added to that).

         After we started Bnet (and later radiolists.net) we
         tried to keep the number of lists manageable, so it
         didn't take forever to check them each day. We added
         a "tech-assist" list to get quick help without a lot of
         chat, and an FCC list to discuss regulatory concepts,
         but otherwise tried to avoid the fragmentation that
         started the same topic on several lists at the same time.

         However, fragmentation became common for three main reasons:
         1. As mailing lists became easier to set up, many were,
                 including "captive" company lists that discouraged (or forbid)
                 sharing any knowledge or experience to outsiders.
                 At least one major company monitored the other lists
                 and came down hard on people who shared anything
                 "to the world."

         2. Some people discovered they could "cross-post" merely
                 by cc:ing to four, five, or ten lists. This usually included
                 at least one Usenet group monitored by spammers, which
                 lead to each participant getting a load of spam
                 minutes after their address (even in a quote) hit
                 the 'net.  A lot of smaller "special interest" lists started
                 to try to stop that.

         3. Some groups felt the best way to stop "chat" was to keep
                 the groups small and heavily moderate content. These
                 lists contain a lot of those folks who scream that their
                 email box "has been destroyed" if they get more than
                 four unexpected emails a day. Their religion forbids them
                 to learn or use filters.

         At the same time, Consolidation and other industry changes
                 brought a greater physical isolation. People need
                 interaction (apparently even Cylons do, too), and
                 a level of chat always remained, even after a
                 question got answered.

                 Most every thread brought out one or two who
                 appreciated the topics and said so, sometimes
                 not well - and got flamed. After all, their post
                 didn't add knowledge. It was "fluff." "The S/N
                 ratio is getting bad" was a constant refrain.
                 "I'm unsubscribing" was a common threat, and
                 more than a few did, not by unsubbing, which
                 would have made sense, but by listing a
                 reflector as "spam" and causing problems for
                 everyone else.

         The one solution that seems to work for many is to
         filter a list, like BROADCAST, into a side directory.
         Using the [BC] or [TA] (for Tech Assist), for example, they
         could divert the 5 (or 40) emails that came to a place
         they could either quickly scan for topics of interest in
         five seconds - or delete them all instaneously, when they
         had no time.

         A few hung on to the old-time religion - no filters - and
         screamed anytime the least bit of light-heartedness
         appeared.

         We have chosen, again for example, to keep
         BROADCAST open to anything that applies to
         broadcast operations. Tech-assist is a more
         "911" list. Occasionally each gets side-tracked, by
         wandering into politics or silliness. The threads
         are monitored and flames are stopped immediately.
         It does take time to do this, but most readers tell me
         they feel more "comfortable" that they don't have
         to worry if a post related to their jobs is going to
         be "blasted."

         Yes, we get a few threads that need to be stopped.
         But, between the Digest mode (many posts in one)
         and filters, even most grouchy people have been
         accommodated. The others complain, read archives,
         lurk, whine (sometimes elsewhere), or go away.

         Many others have been helped and share - even
         if they don't always have 100% modern tech on
         their mind. Those who don't like remembering
         "how things were" can just delete threads - or
         entire day's posts - and move on. Others can
         find a way to chat in public - or take it private
         and build friends.

         There ARE hundreds of lists out there.

         And, if the experience of the past 20 years is
         any guide, there will be those who yearn for
         the opportunity to interact, even if they don't
         have a lot to contribute.

         We should ENCOURAGE that not flame people
         for it.

         The purpose of this note is not to recruit anyone
         to any scheme. It is to show the historical roots
         of the lists and the problems.

         Of course, those who know how to use a filter
         are invited to check out the lists at radiolists.net
         Those who want to hang on to the old-time
         non-filtered religion and receive "by your
         command" messages are welcome to do so.

Sorry, I'm going back into the shadows now ... at least
         as related to this list.

         regards to all.
         barry

______________________________________________________________________
Barry Mishkind     -       Tucson, AZ    -   520-296-3797